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 Issac Body Pillow

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guttersvoice
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PostSubject: Re: Issac Body Pillow   Thu Apr 11, 2013 11:56 am

tbh if its a commission the artist cant really be blamed for the content UnU
i get commissioned for stuff i wouldnt otherwise draw fairly often
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Snarks
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PostSubject: Re: Issac Body Pillow   Thu Apr 11, 2013 12:18 pm

I know the artist draws a lot of porn. There isn't a problem with that. The problem is more of that they're doing porn commissions of webcomic artists' IP. I know the same person has done porn commissions for Gunnerkrigg Court, and the creator wasn't happy to find out about that. Also, this was kind of mentioned, but porn art of underaged characters is a bit unsettling.

I can't really go around saying that people should stop taking fanart commissions. I just honestly think that if it's a fanart commission for a fan of a webcomic series, especially if it is sexually explicit, it would be proper to ask the creator for permission first. If it's just fanart for the hell of it, then just draw the fanart.

Personally, I don't do commissions because I don't like drawing things for other people for money. I'd much rather draw people something as a request or as a gift. That's just me though. /:

Edit: This is probably going to make me seem like an ass, but an artist can be blamed for the content in their art even if the piece was a commission. The artist does have the right to deny commissions. A lot of commission artists don't do that because they really need the money.
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guttersvoice
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PostSubject: Re: Issac Body Pillow   Thu Apr 11, 2013 1:01 pm

speaking as someone who will take literally any commission work because i desperately need the money here

gonna have to politely disagree with you

if the artist of the webcomic has stated 'i dont want people taking fanart commissions because i dont want people making money of my work', in that case, ill definitely not take money to draw fanart for their comic

otherwise, ill take what i can get, whether i enjoy the content or not (im drawing plant guro right now for a commission. not really my thing, but i'm getting paid for it, and that money ensures that i and my flatmate will eat tonight. thats not an exaggeration, i just put the money from paypal into my bank account and he's gone to the shop to buy food.). its not that i 'dont' deny the commissions. it's that i cant.

porn of underaged characters when not aged up also unsettles me, but if im getting paid for it and im in a position where it's the only way i can keep a roof over my flatmate's head, ill probably do it (though i probably wouldnt post it on my blog) (and id probably try to age them up as best i could anyway, but thats beside the point) (and i do have limits with what i will draw but they are considerably dropped during times of need)

honestly, its my opinion that even if the character depicted is someone else's, it's usually the work and time that the commissioner is paying for
would you say the same thing about commissioned fanart for movies or tv shows or anime or whatever? if not, why not? the characters are still someone else's IP.

id love to just draw requests and gifts
but i cant afford to, and my art is the only way i can earn money at the moment
i did say i was going to be polite but that does sort of come across as you thinking of yourself as superior for not relying on commissions to help pay your bills, the way i read it, at least

just my two cents
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Erie, Man of Danger
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PostSubject: Re: Issac Body Pillow   Thu Apr 11, 2013 1:18 pm

Can we agree that the person who commissioned the art get a swift kick in the jaw?

I am not an artist and as such I cannot relate on commissions put food on my table, but I think it would be a good idea to set somewhere the rules of what you won't draw for a commission. That should at least deter those from asking for things such as underage porn art. Just my two cents, whatever little worth it is.
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guttersvoice
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PostSubject: Re: Issac Body Pillow   Thu Apr 11, 2013 1:29 pm

most artists do set rules on what they will and wont draw
i know i tend to
but ill happily lower a few boundaries if im in a financial state where it looks like i wont be able to afford food for a while

and tbh a persons preferences are their own - there are some people who will pay money to see porn of characters who are underage
this could be because they like the characters, or it could be because they like little kids but would look at pictures of cartoon kids over real ones

other people might disagree with either stance - personally id rather not draw underage porn, but if they were aged up to be legal id draw any of the paranatural characters in nsfw situations - but if a persons preferences arent harming others, its not my place to judge them

at the same time, if someone wanted to commission me for something i wasnt willing to draw (in this case, underage porn) and then refused to accept the fact that i wouldnt draw it and got upset and angry over that, id judge them for that, probably

as much as i try not to be a judgemental person, i guess it cant be helped, huh




oh god i think that was mostly an incoherent ramble im sorry
kinda sleep-deprived and on painkillers

EDIT: id like to note that ive never actually been asked to draw anything ive been too uncomfortable with to draw
the only time ive turned someone down for anything like that is the time someone offered to pay $10 for nudes of me
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Erie, Man of Danger
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PostSubject: Re: Issac Body Pillow   Thu Apr 11, 2013 1:35 pm

I guess its just because I am going into the law enforcement side of work, but I don't believe "as long as its not hurting anyone" arguement. It is always hurting someone, usually themselves.
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guttersvoice
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PostSubject: Re: Issac Body Pillow   Thu Apr 11, 2013 1:41 pm

mmh i guess it also depends varying from person to person whether their preferences hurt someone
and also from person to person whether a persons preferences are 'bad'


~*~*~*~*~*~opinions~*~*~*~*~*~

please note i think opinions are pretty magic and great even when i disagree with them
discussions are more fun if theres something people are willing to disagree on on a polite and calm level
theres a word i want to use but i cant quite find it
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Erie, Man of Danger
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PostSubject: Re: Issac Body Pillow   Thu Apr 11, 2013 2:15 pm

guttersvoice wrote:
mmh i guess it also depends varying from person to person whether their preferences hurt someone
and also from person to person whether a persons preferences are 'bad'


~*~*~*~*~*~opinions~*~*~*~*~*~

please note i think opinions are pretty magic and great even when i disagree with them
discussions are more fun if theres something people are willing to disagree on on a polite and calm level
theres a word i want to use but i cant quite find it

You sir, are a better man/woman than I as I cannot respect nor condone the opinions of everyone.

I cannot respect the opinion of white supremacy.
I cannot condone the hate against homosexuality.
I will not have respect for those who think murder is O.K.
I cannot condone those who make or use child/underage pornagraphy.
While, drawings of underage pornagraphy is not same thing as actually underage pornagraphy, it is a real slippery slope that shames both maker and buyer of such products.

I mean no offense, nor do I mean to get into a huge heated debate. I feel very strongly on the subject as I have seen the effects this type of thing can have on a person and have seen the trauma on friends and on fellow students in my area. While nothing is black and white and it is OK to have differing opinions, there is a fine line between a perfect logical and sane reason, and a skewed view of reality and moral dilemnas.
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guttersvoice
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PostSubject: Re: Issac Body Pillow   Thu Apr 11, 2013 2:57 pm

no, youre right there
there are a lot of opinions that are definitely not ones anyone should have
i definitely prefer having calm debates about fictional characters and video games and whatnot to stressful discussions about -isms and suchlike

i guess a prejudice does count as an opinion though that's less the kind of opinion i was thinking of to be honest hahaa
and while i agree it is a slippery slope and cant see or understand any appeal in underage pornography myself, i personally hope that people who are into that kind of thing would choose to look at drawn stuff over real stuff if they have to look at it at all

lets definitely avoid a huge heated debate though, i can agree on that
i think that if people disagree with something someone says, they should be able to make their own point without shouting or resorting to an angry argument

for example id like to point out that your post implies that i condone white supremacy and homophobia and murder
i dont at all! but if i was speaking to someone who did about one of those topics, id definitely do my best to listen to their opinions, even though i dont agree with them

it is the concept of opinions that i find magic and great, rather than the opinions themselves

UvU
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Erie, Man of Danger
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PostSubject: Re: Issac Body Pillow   Thu Apr 11, 2013 4:52 pm

guttersvoice wrote:
no, youre right there
there are a lot of opinions that are definitely not ones anyone should have
i definitely prefer having calm debates about fictional characters and video games and whatnot to stressful discussions about -isms and suchlike

i guess a prejudice does count as an opinion though that's less the kind of opinion i was thinking of to be honest hahaa
and while i agree it is a slippery slope and cant see or understand any appeal in underage pornography myself, i personally hope that people who are into that kind of thing would choose to look at drawn stuff over real stuff if they have to look at it at all

lets definitely avoid a huge heated debate though, i can agree on that
i think that if people disagree with something someone says, they should be able to make their own point without shouting or resorting to an angry argument

for example id like to point out that your post implies that i condone white supremacy and homophobia and murder
i dont at all! but if i was speaking to someone who did about one of those topics, id definitely do my best to listen to their opinions, even though i dont agree with them

it is the concept of opinions that i find magic and great, rather than the opinions themselves

UvU

I am sorry that I gave that impression, I was using those examples to make try to make a point on what I don't comprimise on and why I feel that that type of artistery is wrong and should not be condoned or supported in anyway reguardless of opinion. It is far too close to the real thing, and in my mind is almost just as bad. Again, I am sorry, this to me is a very serious subject and in truth would rather forgo one meal (rather go to a homeless shelter and get a free meal) then even consider supporting or condoning such art. To me, there are far too many choices to make that to ever resort to drawing the art for money.

I mean no assertion to you, your work or your character. Again I am very sorry if I gave that impression.
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guttersvoice
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PostSubject: Re: Issac Body Pillow   Thu Apr 11, 2013 5:00 pm

hahaha its cool, dont worry, i knew you didnt really mean that
my point was mostly just: you said a thing that could be interpreted this way and as such make me look like the villain of the conversation

but the fact is neither of us are the villain

its a good conversation

idk like i said earlier im pretty sleep deprived so not everything im saying is gonna be coherent but what im trying to say is that i was emphasising my preference to stay as level-headed as possible in a discussion and help people build strong arguments rather than rely on logical fallacies

...or something

honestly id happily forego meals and everything for myself
but i have other people to provide for
also my personal morals place myself and my flatmates safety and health over those of a stranger on the internet, because i think its important to be selfish sometimes

youre clearly much more selfless than i am UvU and thats not a bad thing
just a different one
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Snarks
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PostSubject: Re: Issac Body Pillow   Fri Apr 12, 2013 12:39 am

I'm just jumping in to say that I'm sorry that I came off that I was superior in anyway because I don't do commissions. Honestly, I've tried opening them up before. I've done a few here and there. I don't really have a good reason why I didn't push doing commissions more. Regardless, I'm sorry for if I made it seem like I considered myself superior to you, that wasn't the intention at all.
I do have to say, I do have a lot of respect for you for for putting yourself and your flatmates first.

Anywho, I think now is a good time to say this is a good place to end the conversation on the topic at hand?
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guttersvoice
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PostSubject: Re: Issac Body Pillow   Fri Apr 12, 2013 1:02 am

good idea, im up for ending this here UvU
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Parallegience
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PostSubject: Re: Issac Body Pillow   Fri Apr 12, 2013 10:05 pm

Snarks wrote:
I can't really go around saying that people should stop taking fanart commissions. I just honestly think that if it's a fanart commission for a fan of a webcomic series, especially if it is sexually explicit, it would be proper to ask the creator for permission first. If it's just fanart for the hell of it, then just draw the fanart.

That would be not a good idea. A popular webcomic like Gunnerkrigg Court has tons of fans and that would be many emails in the creator's inbox asking if they have their permission to draw their characters in sexual situations. Not really something the creator wants to see. As long as no one links the artist they'll probably never see it and it should never be a problem.

Also Tom wasn't unhappy that porn of his characters was drawn per se he was unhappy it was showed to him and that someone got money from his characters. He doesn't care how people draw his characters, he doesn't like others making money off of his stuff.
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PostSubject: Re: Issac Body Pillow   Sat Apr 13, 2013 12:48 am

That's actually why I said commissions though?
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Issac Body Pillow

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